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Brad Fitzpatrick

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good shit [Mar. 19th, 2001|02:09 am]
Brad Fitzpatrick
still workin' on the freevote server move.
debian rules. redhat sucks.
i'd told marcus that earlier, but now he's convinced too.
working on the debian system's a joy.
working with redhat is like ... the worst of all pains.
I used to hate those debian elitist bastards that shoved debian in my face at any possible moment, but it's so justified... go try debian out on a spare computer. you'll fall in love, too.
marcus went and got jack in the box.
that, and pizza earlier .... damn good eatin' today
going to oregon tomorrow with kenji, amy and blythe.
gonna visit my parents than go to the beach for a few days
i have several packages (including the lj-stan server) on their way.... hope they show up before I leave
ripping my whole (old) CD collection ... because I hadn't ever ripped all of them, and some of my old rips/encodings weren't great.... back in the early days of audio extraction on shitty IDE cd-roms, before they supported it natively.
that is all.
back to workin'.

[User Picture]From: kvance
2001-03-19 02:30 am (UTC)
I dunno, I wasn't all that impressed when I was running debian on my laptop. I think it stems from my deep-seated hatred of all package managers...
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[User Picture]From: hawk
2001-03-19 03:27 am (UTC)
Yeah. But that's probably because you're on a laptop. I couldn't get Debian to play nice with my network cards on my laptop. Redhat either. Mandrake's autodetection sent green tendrils of linuxy goodness all over the fucker, and now I've got a net drop. But if I ever get around to saving up for a desktop system (soon...) I'll be dual booting: Mandrake and Debian. And the smart money's riding on the Debian partition for the long haul. In terms of user friendly, though, distro's like 'drake will be the salvation of linux. Win the hearts of the people...their minds will follow.
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[User Picture]From: ender
2001-03-19 03:34 am (UTC)
I got it to work first try on my Toshiba Sat 4300 - even got a livejournal server running on it :p

Had a bit of a cow getting X to work on my flatmates Gateway tho. Once the new release comes out with x4.0.2, things will be sooo much better for laptops.
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[User Picture]From: hawk
2001-03-19 03:57 am (UTC)
And for this I am non-trivially excited.
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[User Picture]From: topher
2001-03-19 09:21 am (UTC)

How long?

Out of curiosity, how long did you run Debian?

When I was using Red Hat and NetBSD, I disparaged package managers and thought they were annoying, frustrating, and caused more problems then they fixed.

I finally gave Debian a try because I'd heard that it actually did package management "right". At first, I was skeptical that Debian would be worth my time, and I felt justified in that belief, as Debian isn't overly friendly on introduction.

The install isn't hard really, but it expects you to know what you're doing, and especially when I first installed it, before tasksel, going through every single package in dselect was. . . tedious. ;-)

So I used it, and after a few months, I realized that it really wasn't all that bad. A few more months, and I grudgingly admitted that it was pretty good. Finally, I realized that I loved it. It's not just that apt-get rocks (which it does), but it's how it gives you so much control over the whole process.

If I want to install/upgrade packages without thought, then 'apt-get update && apt-get upgrade' will do it for me. If I want to look at the source before installing, 'apt-get source package' will get it for me. I can even patch and tinker with it, before then building that source into a Debian package.

That was when I really started to appreciate Debian. It allows you exactly as much micromanaging over what it does as you want, or as little. ;-)

A friend of mine who's recently become a Debian convert said of Debian:
"Debian is like milk. From what you've heard, it's good, but no one can give you a real reason, so it seems rather bland. Then you try it, and you start to think that it's gone sour on you, as it's got an archaic installer and isn't very pretty. However, if you give it enough time, you find yourself with a perfectly aged cheese, tangy, but delectible, and well worth it."
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[User Picture]From: bradfitz
2001-03-19 11:59 am (UTC)

Re: How long?

That's a terrible description of an operating system.... cheese??? hehhe. ;)
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[User Picture]From: topher
2001-03-19 12:27 pm (UTC)

Re: How long?

I have to admit, it's not exactly what I would have used as an analogy. . . but it does seem to (sorta, in an odd and twisted way) get it's meaning across. ;-)
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[User Picture]From: kvance
2001-03-19 01:22 pm (UTC)

Re: How long?

I ran debian for a few months on the laptop. The install process was plenty easy. Since I've been through three OpenBSD installs, any Linux distro installer is quite friendly :)

To me, the package manager wasn't any better than redhat's. It still had broken dependencies, I had to reinstall once when I completely destroyed my packages, etc. The "apt-get upgrade" sounds great, but by the time the package maintainer has posted the new package, I've probably already downloaded and installed the next version. Plus, because of bandwidth, I usually don't upgrade unless there are horrible bugs.

Once I got the packages installed, the system worked fine. But for all that effort, I probably could've rolled my own in the time, init scripts and all. My new machine is probably going to be distro free.
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From: piman
2001-03-20 07:54 pm (UTC)

Re: How long?

Having once rolled my own distro (Hee hee, remember? Baked GNU/Linux? Hee hee...) I can say it's a lot harder than it looks, and you'll almost certainly end up looking substantially like whatever base you used.

Plus such a system builds up cruft like a fucker.
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[User Picture]From: chris
2001-03-20 10:16 pm (UTC)
I use Debain pretty much exclusively when I have any say in the matter.
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